Spears

[Sheldon Bedell]

Why have I not heard of any of the FMA that teaches spear tactics. It seems that the spear was used in warfare so why is it still not taught?

[Balintawak]

Why have I not heard of any of the FMA that teaches spear tactics. It seems that the spear was used in warfare so why is it still not taught?

Good Point.

My Guess, and there are some that do staff like work, or longer stick, so I would imagine they have some of the spear work in there. I also know that some have Bayonet techniques for practicality, and this could have been originally Spear work modified to a modern weapon.

Hoping someone can actual point and say this art teaches Spear, versus what I can say, of I see it could be, or that one technique could have been.

[arnisador]

Now that you mention, that is odd...I've seen it used in FMA demos, but never saw someone whose art taught it, that I know of.

[lhommedieu]

I've seen three FMA's that have a spear curriculum:

Kombatan

Pekiti Tirsia Kali

San Miguel Eskrima

A search on the Eskrima Digest FAQ page http://www.martialartsresource.com/a...sts/fmafaq.htm

for "spear" showed that the Inayan System of Eskrima and Sayoc Kali also include spear in their curriculum.

Best,

Steve Lamade

[Buwaya]

My thoughts.

The wars that the majority of FMA systems actively took part in(WW2, Philippine revolution) did not involve(except perhaps in rare instances) spearplay.

Most FMA systems for the most part cannot trace themselves farther than the late 1800s, early 1900s. The systems that can(Doce Pares, Pekiti Tirsa/Dekiti Tirsia, Ilustrisimo) Don't come from regions that I think of haveing a living, thriving martial spear culture.

Groups that do(some cases did) have a living martial spear culture, such as the lumad and BangsaMoro aren't opening up clubs and gyms and having membership drives(except for a few fairly recent exceptions).

That being said I beleive in the Dogbrothers video "the Grandfathers Speak" you can see the Villibrille Largusa demo team doing spear. Also note in Tobosa's section of Philippine Martial culture you can see GM Villibrille in a photo holding a spear.

Dekiti Tirsia also has spear work and Doblette Rapillion had a bayonet curriculum.

[Sheldon Bedell]

Good points of thought thanks


Wish we could get someone from these systems that do teach the spear to tell us a little of the training

[arnisador]

Does Ric Jornales teach it in his Arnis-Sikaran? I know I've seen him use it in demos, but then, he uses everything in demos!

[wes tasker]

Greetings-

I can speak, at least a little bit, of the spear work in Pekiti Tirsia as taught by Tuhon Bill McGrath. Their are 12 warm ups taught at first that teach basic mechanics of thrusts, hits, and weapon manipulation so that you can effectively use the weapon without getting in your own way. Then there are 2 sets of 12 "techniques" that are based on the first two sets of Solo Baston Seguidas. The first set of "techniques" are based on long range tactics where there are responses to either an enemies direct attacks or when an initial attack is blocked and/or intercepted. The second set are more middle range techniques with entering strategies and solutions to the "problems" one might encounter by being in middle to close range with a primarily long range tool. The reason I put "techniques" in italics is that I look at them as more of examples of a particular mechanic / strategy / principle then dogmatic things to follow.

These sets adapt well to long staff. A shorter staff of around 48 - 50 inches is used in a slightly different way in Pekiti Tirsia. From what Tuhon Bill has explained, the techniques are based on a boar spear the height of the user with a double edged blade a hand and a half long with tines that are at either end of the base of the blade. I hope this helps.

-wes tasker

[lhommedieu]

As with the other ancillary weapons of San Miguel Esrkima, the spear is used to train whole-body connection and to develop attributes that Momoy Canete considered essential to espada y daga technique. Because both hands are placed on the shaft of the spear, both shoulders are engaged and the legs and waist are coordinated to generate speed and power.

I learned a long form and a two-man set using a six foot length of 1 1/4" hickory, so this "spear" is somewhat heavier than its longer Chinese cousins, and thus may also reflect an agricultural or hunting tradition - as Wes Tasker mentions above.

Movements are simple, powerful, and direct. There is emphasis placed in the form on 90 degree turns into an opponent that are followed by linear stepping patterns and basic horizontal and diagonal strikes that change levels from high to low to high, etc. Both the point and butt are used striking and thrusting. Thrusts are made by bringing the rear hand up to the front hand and allowing the spear to slide between the fingers of the front hand; there is also a rear thrust with the butt wherein both hands are moved backwards. Twirls are basic and practical and follow upward and downward diagonals, "figure 8's," etc. Footwork in the two-man set is primarily linear but includes stepping off-line to accomodate parries and counters.

http://northshoreac.com/san_miguel_e...aw_example.jpg

Best,

Steve Lamade

[arnisador]

My Guess, and there are some that do staff like work, or longer stick, so I would imagine they have some of the spear work in there.

I've heard this suggested--that just as we know that the stick can represent a sword, we should figure that the staff can represent a spear. But most FMA staff work I've seen has been more "double-ended" (for want of a better word) than I'd expect if it truly represented a spear. The stick is used with blade awareness, so the translation makes sense...but in my experience the staff is not used with as much "tip-awareness" as would be the case for a spear.

One explanation I've heard for this is that perhaps the "spear" was in many cases just a staff with a pointed end, rather than a bladed end, so the tip was not as deadly as all that and using both ends made more sense. I don't know; I've seen many pictures and live examples of Filipino swords, and even own a few, but not many spears that are clearly of Filipino origin.

It does seem odd to me not to see more emphasis on it. If you lived in the Philippines and your village was going to battle against another village that had swords for weapons....wouldn't you fashion yourself a spear/glaive/halberd? It seems like an obvious thing to do. Polearms were common in both European and Oriental warfare (e.g. Chinese spear, Japanese naginata). I know they exist in the Philippines, of course--I'm just surprised not to see more emphasis on them. Judging from the last two posts, perhaps this reflects my experience more than the actual facts, though!