Serrada Empty Hand

[jwinch2]

Any information on this? I have been looking for some video for examples of empty hand material out of the Serrada system. Since I have zero exposure to the art, I have no way of knowing what is out there and whether or not it would be representative or not. That's why I'm asking all of you!:laugh:

Anything to share?

I look forward to your responses...

[patrickdpr]

There is a book with some of it by Anthony Davis. Can't give it my recommendation really, but it is available.

[silat1]

Jimmy Tacosa also had some kadena de mano on his serrada dvds that were available.. I would google his name as I know he had them available in the site he had from Hawaii.. You might can try there..

[lhommedieu]

Take a look at some of Rene Latosa's stuff. He had a Cadena de Mano DVD in the past (Panther Publications or ESPY?) and his current website features a DVD on "Short Power." Mr. Latosa's early influences include Serrada so it stands to reason that this material is at least partly based in the art. I've always liked his no-BS approach to FMA's. If you do get the DVD let me know what you think.

Best,

Steve

[jwinch2]

Does the Cadena de Mano stuff come from Serrada e.g. GM Cabales, or is that an influence from somewhere else? The reason I ask is that it was my understanding that the Latosa material was an amalgam of more than one system... I could be wrong on that so if I am, I apologize.

[silat1]

You should also look at the Kadena de Mano stuff from the Inayan Group.. Suro Mike Inay was heavily involved with serrada when he was studying with GM Cabales.. Inayan system also covers various other aspects of the fma.. Plus from what I understand, Suro Mike's program was taught to some law enforcement agencies over the years, so that kinda tips the scales in practicality

[jwinch2]

Thanks Bill. I will do that.

[ctrinidude]

FYI; I am still a novice at Serrada. Serrada (Davis/cabales)is one of four systems that is taught at the FMA school I go to. I've seen my instructer and his senior students demonstrate the stick and empty hand counters and to me it looks like the movements are almost identical. To my understanding serrada and cadena de mano come from two different people (Cabales and Max Sarmiento) but the two men taught underneath the same roof so I wouldn't be surprised if they influenced each other.

I found this video to mimick the serrada counters:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWrviw6M9Eo

[jwinch2]

I just got off the phone with Mr. Ron Saturno who was very generous with his time and this is one of the questions that I asked him. Keep in mind that any mistakes in the information provided here are mine and not his.

From what I understand, GM Cabales did not talk a bunch about empty hand and much of it was kept relatively hidden. In addition, it is my understanding that many of GM Cabales' students were impressed with Max Sarmiento's Cadena de Mano and wanted to learn that empty hand system so that by the time Angel Cabales got around to teaching empty hand material, most of his students already had a perspective due to their interaction with GM Sarmiento and his system. With that in mind, it is my impression that the vast majority of empty hand work done by Serrada practitioners is an amalgam of Serrada and Cadena de Mano rather than Serrada alone.

Thanks (http://www.fmatalk.com/showthread.php?8143-Public-thanks-to-Mr.-Ron-Saturno) again to Mr. Saturno who was incredibly generous with his time and knowledge today!

[lhommedieu]

Does the Cadena de Mano stuff come from Serrada e.g. GM Cabales, or is that an influence from somewhere else? The reason I ask is that it was my understanding that the Latosa material was an amalgam of more than one system... I could be wrong on that so if I am, I apologize.

No sure...According to his website two of his earliest teachers were Angel Cabeles and Max Sarmiento. I (think I) also recall reading (a long time ago) that Mr. Latosa's earliest teachers were his father and uncles and that they were agricultural workers in central California. If his current system is an amalgram that's not necessarily a bad thing; it looks like he's teaching the material that feels comfortable to him.

I can't say that I know much beyond the little I've read and the videos that I looked at back in the mid-nineties. From what I recall the material was simple, direct, and practical.

Best,

Steve

[pguinto]

Im not a cert'd authority, so i can only speak of the little bit of exposure i received and remember. Serrada has its own "Cadena"; all the stick counters/movements/sequences taught for the 12 angles formally translate into open hand counters/movements/sequences for Serrrada Kadena. Sarmiento did certify some members of the early Cabales group; but Sarmiento's Kadena was not the same as Angel's Cadena. Sarmiento's Kadena is its own seperate system, and only a few were certified (master diploma) by him to teach it; one of whom was Jimmy Tacosa. Basic open hand eskrima can be found in the Tacosa dvds.

[lhommedieu]

I looked at a clip of Mr. Latosa teaching in Italy last year and the technique that he was showing looked a lot like a mix of cadena de mano and boxing with some center-line angling and checking theory applied as well. Nice stuff and certainly something that could be taken from or extrapolated to stick and blade work.

Funny thing is, I was working on something similar with my instructor just last week, i.e. filing down an incoming force from the outside and jamming the center from an outside angle. Whether it's called "Serrada" or whatever else the fundamental principles still apply.

Best,

Steve

[jwinch2]

I agree Steve. There do seem to be several "universal" principles in FMA. Particularly when looking at empty hand material it seems.