Passengers Took Plane’s Survival Into Own Hands.

[arnisador]

Passengers Took Plane’s Survival Into Own Hands (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/27/us/27plane.html)


And then history repeated itself. Just as occurred before Christmas in 2001 when Richard C. Reid tried to ignite the plastic explosives hidden in his shoe on a trans-Atlantic flight, fellow passengers jumped on Mr. Abdulmutallab, restraining the 23-year-old Nigerian. Crew members poured bottled water on the flames, snuffing out the sparks of what could have been a planewide conflagration.

Anotehr headline I saw talked about them having put the suspect in a headlock.


One passenger who was sitting in the same row as Mr. Abdulmutallab, but on the right side of the plane, apparently hurled himself across a middle row of four seats to tackle him.

ThHe first story I read on this said he had just set off firecrackers--it sounded stupid, but not terrorist. This is going to make air travel even less pleasant in the near future. Even a failure like this is a partial victory in that they make things harder and more expensive for us.

[arnisador]

Jasper Schuringa subdued alleged terrorist Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab on Northwest Airlines 253 (http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/2009/12/26/2009-12-26_jasper_schuringa_helped_subdue_alleged_terroris t_umar_farouk_abdulmutallab_on_no.html#ixzz0ap5lQ0 LY)




But he was only certain something was wrong when he saw smoke. He saw Abdulmutallab's pants open and he was holding a burning object between his legs.

"I pulled the object from him and tried to extinguish the fire with my hands and threw it away," Schuringa said.

He said he then screamed for water and pulled Abdulmutallab out of his seat and dragged him to the front of the plane.
[...]
To ensure the suspect did not have other explosives on his body, Schuringa stripped off Abdulmutallab's clothes. He then handcuffed the alleged attacker with the help of a crew member.

[silat1]

This gives new meaning to the stricter security for american flag carriers that fly international routes.. We are going to be in for a long rough road as far as travel and it is up to us to protect our own.. The federal airmarshal program is sorely undermanned and should be brought up to par..

[PG Michael B]

The federal airmarshal program is sorely undermanned and should be brought up to par

I agree Billy....I was denied due to my tattoo's...LOL....Passed all the tests, background etc....Instead they look for politically correct....IMHO politically correct is how we got in this mess to begin with. Time to start being like John Wayne toilet paper..Rough & Tough and take no Shite! It amazes me how naive those who are supposedly running the show are. They are so out of touch with the streets that they can't even comprehend simple solutions. Instead they do more of the same.

I guess we're to old for all this, eh Billy? They wanna fill the ranks with pups being led along like a Donkey on a Carrot!....

[Carol]

I agree Billy....I was denied due to my tattoo's...LOL....Passed all the tests, background etc....Instead they look for politically correct....IMHO politically correct is how we got in this mess to begin with. Time to start being like John Wayne toilet paper..Rough & Tough and take no Shite! It amazes me how naive those who are supposedly running the show are. They are so out of touch with the streets that they can't even comprehend simple solutions. Instead they do more of the same.

I guess we're to old for all this, eh Billy? They wanna fill the ranks with pups being led along like a Donkey on a Carrot!....

Put the nice clean cut young men in business suits on the rush hour shuttles between LaGuardia and Boston where they will blend in with the other nice clean cut young men in business suits.

Otherwise, hell, give 'em an iPod, a few tatts, airline seat hair, or too many bags/kids/animals. Perhaps then no one will realize they are LEOs. ;)

[PG Michael B]

Nicely put Carol.

[jwinch2]

Unfortunately, in a situation such as the one on Christmas, the action would have likely been over before an Air Marshall could have gotten there anyways. Unless they are going to start putting 5 of them on every single flight, we are always going to be responsible for our own safety. Just like in the rest of our lives, the police cannot be everywhere and they are not likely to show up until after.

[PG Michael B]

Unfortunately, in a situation such as the one on Christmas, the action would have likely been over before an Air Marshall could have gotten there anyways. Unless they are going to start putting 5 of them on every single flight, we are always going to be responsible for our own safety. Just like in the rest of our lives, the police cannot be everywhere and they are not likely to show up until after.

I agree my friend. That is why every time I fly I take a nice solid durable ball point pen and two sturdy rubber bands. The rubber bands bind the inflight ragazine into a nice compact sap and the pen doubles nicely as a dagger...learn how to work side body and do what you gotta do if it goes down. I figure if I'm 15,000 feet in the air and some dip **** is gonna kill us all I might as well make him feel it all the way down....LOL...follow his jihadi ass straight into heaven and cock block those 72 vestal virgins right out from under his ass.

[jwinch2]

I agree my friend. That is why every time I fly I take a nice solid durable ball point pen and two sturdy rubber bands. The rubber bands bind the inflight ragazine into a nice compact sap and the pen doubles nicely as a dagger...learn how to work side body and do what you gotta do if it goes down. I figure if I'm 15,000 feet in the air and some dip **** is gonna kill us all I might as well make him feel it all the way down....LOL...follow his jihadi ass straight into heaven and cock block those 72 vestal virgins right out from under his ass.

I like your style Michael.

I'm no expert but I imagine it is hard to enjoy all that virginal goodness with your balls shoved down your own throat and a ball point pen sticking out of your perineam. Those fine ladies might as well move on over to someone who can actually handle business.

Now that I have offended all the of the ladies on this board, I think it is time for bed... :laugh:

[silat1]

If the people had been more ruthless on that flight, that sucker would have become a dirt dart.. Would have been a sight to see his naked keester whistling through the air at 200mph when dropped out of the plane at 10K feet.. Let him see the 72 virgins on the way down.. I think in this vision the scene would have been 230lb dudes named bubba.

[Carol]

If the people had been more ruthless on that flight, that sucker would have become a dirt dart.. Would have been a sight to see his naked keester whistling through the air at 200mph when dropped out of the plane at 10K feet.. Let him see the 72 virgins on the way down.. I think in this vision the scene would have been 230lb dudes named bubba.

To hell with that. The planes fly over my house at 10,000 feet. The wasps in the patio umbrella this summer were bad enough, I don't want to be cleaning up dead terrorist scumbag parts too! ;)

I think we should take matters in to our own hands and carry improvised weapons on board in case of an emergency.

[silat1]

I agree my friend. That is why every time I fly I take a nice solid durable ball point pen and two sturdy rubber bands. The rubber bands bind the inflight ragazine into a nice compact sap and the pen doubles nicely as a dagger...learn how to work side body and do what you gotta do if it goes down. I figure if I'm 15,000 feet in the air and some dip **** is gonna kill us all I might as well make him feel it all the way down....LOL...follow his jihadi ass straight into heaven and cock block those 72 vestal virgins right out from under his ass.

Mike,
Both you and I know what kind of bullshi* that we put up with when we were in the military.. It appears that everyone is touchy feely now and the way I know that you are, resembles the kind of touchy feely feeling that I have for these individuals who dictate (prime word in this is dick) up the chain.. They try to make the old warriors out of place, yet who are they going to call when the stuff hits the fan, or who is the first on the line to take matters in their own hands.. Those of us who were there and done that in our youth..

But you know as I do that if we even look at someone or say something wrong to the individuals in charge, we are up a creek without a paddle.. I was consuled 3 times for a comment I made about the military guys I work with now.. Man talk about stress management old school, these guys can never get anything done because they cry everytime some one has something to say to them.. It pains me to see that the warrior culture that we used to take part in has degraded down to a bunch of milksops who are afraid to stand up and make decisions for the better of the troops or to put people in place and hold them accountable for actions that they screw up..

But that is another thread..

The way we were trained is a thing of the past now.. But if you remember the oath we took we took everytime we rose our right hand to defend the constitution and against individuals both domestic and foreign who try to overtly and covertly destroy our way of life has changed a lot over the last 15-20 yrs.. It is because of the politicos who are trying to be buddy buddy with everyone and when we have 3rd world countries dictating how we operate out military actions, it makes me mad as hell that we allow this to happen..

Who knows one day we might have another political change and get things back on the path that they were before we went touchy feely as a society..

[eskrimakaliarnis.com]

My father was recently working for a large Airline company managing their onboard security and flying as an Air Marshall as well.

This company recruited from special forces type personal all around the world.

I was surprised that a high percentage of carriers do not have an air marshall program. His contract and those of the Marshalls was terminated at Christmas.

One of the options the airline was looking at was getting cabin crew trained up. Imagine that!

I guess it's kind of inevitable in this kind of economy that cost-cutting measures be put into place. I would hate to think that it would be at the expense of people's safety.

It certainly remind me not to switch off during flights and the application of FMA in confined spaces.

[silat1]

To hell with that. The planes fly over my house at 10,000 feet. The wasps in the patio umbrella this summer were bad enough, I don't want to be cleaning up dead terrorist scumbag parts too! ;)

I think we should take matters in to our own hands and carry improvised weapons on board in case of an emergency.


Carol,
The way I look at these field expedient weapons, you are leaving a couple of items out.. For one, you forgot SPAM and Vienna Sausages, those would be more of a deterent than the weapons you attached..

As far as dropping the terrorist out of the plane at 10K ft, there wouldn't be much left that you couldn't hose off and down the drain.. The terminal velocity of the body would be in excess of 200mph and that way, you could clean him up with a squeegie and hose.. That is how it was taken care of in the older days when men were men and the women didn't care.. :EvilGrin:

[arnisador]

Let's remember that it's probably just as well that the would-be bomber survived so he can be interrogated.

[silat1]

Does the term waterboarding have anything to do to get his reasons to get things answered.. I think it will be a way to find out if he can see the errors of his way.

[PG Michael B]

Well there is always Uncle Charlies glass rod and boot trick ..that sumbitch will make you give up the location of Hoffa.......